INWHY Today at 7:53 AMam I able to loose money after force-closing channels?Screenshot 2019-10-23 at 7.51.16.pngScreenshot 2019-10-23 at 7.51.16.png50 repliesWill O'Beirne 2 hours agoYes, if you force close using an older invalid state, they can take the money while it's timelocked if their node is online.INWHY 2 hours agowow... looks like I lost 4BTCINWHY 2 hours agobecause my LND wasn't syncronised, that's weird (edited)moli 2 hours ago#reckless :rekt:INWHY 2 hours agoit was buggy and stuck...moli 2 hours agoto be frank this isn't the first time i've seen you with the same issue of carelessly locking so much money on useless nodes and then decided to just mass close them allINWHY 2 hours agoI've used the default closeallchannels --force function, nothing else, to be frank. (edited)INWHY 2 hours agoalso, my node wasn't useless, but one of the biggest in the network, called LIGHTNING-CASINO.COMmoli 2 hours agoah this time it's worse because you force closed from an older statemoli 2 hours agoyou know it's a "no-no", right? because it's a breachINWHY 2 hours agoI've force-closed from a backup, because there was a power outage, then why the "no-no" function is ever available?! (edited)moli 2 hours agohow old was the backup?INWHY 2 hours agofew days prior, but after force-closing them the LND got stuck without synchronising the graphINWHY 1 hour agoI'm working as a system administrator, have some server knowledge and I bet that everybody who have bigger node will face the same issues, it happens only when you close* you channels, openings are finemoli 1 hour agoso the backup is a few days old? even a few minutes or hours old , they can cause a breach, that's how it isINWHY 1 hour agothen how to proceed if the channel graph file is broken? that happened after updating from vulnerable LND 6.1 to 7.1 betaINWHY 1 hour ago@moli if "few minutes" old backup can cause a breach, that means that LND doesn't support backups at all, am I right? make backups and after 10 minutes they are old and unusable... (edited)moli 1 hour ago@INWHY since the beginning of lnd and lightning network, we've been told not to do backupsmoli 1 hour agochannel state is very dynamic you can't back it up like any static filesINWHY 1 hour agowhat's the purpose of the backup functions then?moli 1 hour agowhat backup functions?INWHY 1 hour agoexportchanbackup and restorechanbackupmoli 1 hour agothat is differentINWHY 1 hour agoI have those filesmoli 1 hour agothose files are for recovery, but you said you did a backup of the data directory .lnd and you ran it after a power outage?INWHY 1 hour agoyes, am I able to use those recovery SCB files?INWHY 1 hour agoalso, they are 3 different types, JSON one, binary one, and 2nd type of binary onemoli 1 hour agoyes, which lnd version are you running?INWHY 1 hour ago7.1INWHY 1 hour agoScreenshot 2019-10-23 at 9.16.30.pngScreenshot 2019-10-23 at 9.16.30.pngINWHY 1 hour agoScreenshot 2019-10-23 at 9.17.01.pngScreenshot 2019-10-23 at 9.17.01.pngmoli 1 hour agoso did you run the SCB ? how did you run the "backup" ?INWHY 1 hour agovia exportchanbackup --all > backupINWHY 1 hour agoand exportchanbackup --output_file channel-backup-filemoli 1 hour agobut you said you ran a .lnd backup and force closed all your channels? (edited)moli 1 hour agothis is very confusingINWHY 1 hour agoyes, using previous files state. I wonder, am I able to use those static channel backups at the moment? (edited)moli 1 hour agonomoli 1 hour agoyou have already closed all your channels with an older state? that's it, the money is goneINWHY 1 hour agohow can I know if the state is older or not?moli 1 hour agothe backup was a few days oldINWHY 1 hour agoas you said even few minutes old backup is enough to cause a breach, which makes them totally unusableINWHY 1 hour agoin my case, I have veeam backups for the last ~320 days + SCBs, + paper backup, and after force-closing all channels which LND approved and initiated, my funds are lost and unavailablemoli 1 hour agoif you run an older backup, lnd still can run but when you force close channels, that's when the breach happensINWHY 1 hour agounderstood, my final conclusion is that just need to forgot about backups there... or need to make totally live SCBs every single second... (edited)moli 1 hour agoafter the power outage if your current .lnd data could not start, you could use the SCB recovery and it would ask your peers to close channels and you would get your money backINWHY 1 hour agoI was unable to recover the channels from the SCB, because there was an error that those channels are already existing, about the peers there are more than 400 channels, just cannot contact them. (edited)INWHY 45 minutes agoI bet that exchanges will start using that technology only* if they have a good and stable backup structure... without it only enthusiast like me will rush on it (edited)INWHY 40 minutes ago@moli thank you for all that info. appreciatedmoli 38 minutes agonp, sorry for your loss.. but please this is so fundamental i hope you would do some reading or asking for help before doing something drastic next time:+1::skin-tone-3: via /r/Bitcoin http://bit.ly/31E2HLp
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